⚠️ SAFETY: Bow and Arrow Choke Variations targets the Carotid arteries and trachea. Risk: Carotid artery compression causing loss of consciousness. Release immediately upon tap.

The Bow and Arrow Choke variations represent a family of highly effective finishing techniques from back control that combine lapel manipulation with lower body control to create an inescapable strangle. Unlike the standard Bow and Arrow which relies on a single configuration, these variations adapt to different defensive responses, body types, and positional contexts. The fundamental principle remains constant across all variations: using the opponent’s lapel as a primary choking mechanism while the legs create extension and angle to tighten the strangle. What makes these variations particularly dangerous is their ability to transition seamlessly between different configurations based on the opponent’s defensive reactions. Each variation addresses specific scenarios - whether the opponent is defending the lapel grip, fighting the leg position, or attempting to relieve pressure through posture changes. The technical diversity within this system allows practitioners to maintain offensive pressure even as opponents attempt standard defenses. These variations are especially valued in gi competition where lapel control provides mechanical advantages unavailable in no-gi grappling.

Category: Choke Type: Blood Choke Target Area: Carotid arteries and trachea Starting Position: Back Control Success Rates: Beginner 35%, Intermediate 50%, Advanced 65%

Safety Guide

Injury Risks:

InjurySeverityRecovery Time
Carotid artery compression causing loss of consciousnessHighImmediate recovery if released promptly; potential for serious injury if held after unconsciousness
Tracheal damage from improper lapel placementMedium1-3 weeks for bruising; potential for serious injury with excessive force
Neck strain or cervical spine stress from forced extensionMedium3-7 days for minor strain; up to 6 weeks for significant injury
Shoulder or rotator cuff strain from arm entrapmentMedium1-2 weeks for minor strain

Application Speed: SLOW and progressive - minimum 3-5 seconds from initial tightening to full pressure

Tap Signals:

  • Verbal tap or verbal distress signal
  • Physical hand tap on partner or mat
  • Physical foot tap on mat or partner
  • Any loss of resistance or unusual body response
  • Frantic movement or panic signals

Release Protocol:

  1. Immediately release lapel grip completely
  2. Remove leg extension and straighten opponent’s body
  3. Allow opponent to recover in neutral position
  4. Check for consciousness and breathing
  5. Do not immediately restart rolling - allow full recovery time

Training Restrictions:

  • Never apply full finishing pressure in drilling - stop at control position
  • Never hold the choke after partner has tapped
  • Always ensure training partner has clear access to tap
  • Never practice on significantly smaller or less experienced partners at full intensity
  • Avoid rapid jerking motions when extending the legs
  • Do not practice finishing mechanics until fundamental control is mastered

Key Principles

  • Lapel depth determines choking efficiency - deeper lapel insertion creates tighter strangle with less effort required
  • Leg extension creates the finishing angle - without proper hip drive and leg straightening, the choke remains loose
  • Body angle relative to opponent’s spine affects pressure distribution - perpendicular angles maximize compression
  • The non-choking hand controls opponent’s defensive grips and maintains positional control throughout
  • Timing the transition from back control to finishing position is critical - premature attempts allow escapes
  • Multiple grip configurations provide backup options when primary setups are defended
  • Shoulder position relative to opponent’s head determines whether pressure affects carotids versus trachea

Prerequisites

  • Established back control with at least one hook secured and seat belt grip maintained
  • Access to opponent’s lapel with ability to feed it across their neck without significant resistance
  • Opponent’s defensive posture managed - hands controlled or occupied to prevent grip breaks
  • Sufficient space to transition from back control to side position while maintaining choking pressure
  • Hip positioning that allows for leg extension without losing connection to opponent’s body
  • Awareness of opponent’s defensive hand positions and ability to counter grip fighting attempts

Execution Steps

  1. Secure deep lapel grip: From back control with seat belt established, use your choking side hand (typically the hand that is under their armpit) to reach across and grip the far side of their collar as deeply as possible. The thumb should be inside the collar, and you want your fingers to reach past their carotid artery on the far side. This grip is fundamental - insufficient depth here compromises the entire technique. If the opponent is defending the collar, use your body weight to post them forward momentarily or use your non-choking hand to clear their defensive grips before establishing your deep collar hold. (Timing: 3-5 seconds to establish without rushing) [Pressure: Moderate]
  2. Control the opposite lapel: With your non-choking hand, reach over their shoulder and grip their near-side lapel at approximately chest level. This grip serves multiple purposes: it prevents them from turning into you, controls their posture, and provides a handle to manipulate their upper body as you transition. The grip should be firm but not your primary focus - your choking hand grip is more important. Some variations feed this lapel across for the choke, while others use it purely for control. Maintain constant tension on both lapels to limit their defensive options. (Timing: 2-3 seconds) [Pressure: Moderate]
  3. Secure leg position variation: This is where variations diverge significantly. Classic variation: insert your top leg (away from their head) across their hip/thigh while keeping your bottom hook in place. High variation: bring your top leg higher across their shoulder/neck area to create additional downward pressure. Low variation: keep both legs hooking their hips but prepare to extend. Truck variation: if they turn into you, transition to truck position with both legs controlling their lower body. The leg positioning determines which variation you’re executing - choose based on their defensive posture and body position. (Timing: 2-4 seconds for position establishment) [Pressure: Light]
  4. Hip escape and angle creation: Begin moving your hips away from their back toward a perpendicular angle. This hip escape is crucial - it transforms the position from back control into the bow and arrow configuration. As you escape your hips, maintain constant tension on your choking grip while using your legs to control their hip/shoulder position. Your body should end up at roughly 90 degrees to their spine. The angle variation you choose depends on their defense: standard angle (perpendicular), high angle (toward their head), or low angle (toward their hips). Each angle addresses different defensive postures. (Timing: 3-5 seconds for complete angle adjustment) [Pressure: Moderate]
  5. Extend legs for tightening mechanism: Begin straightening your legs to create extension force. The top leg pushes against their shoulder/hip while the bottom leg pulls in the opposite direction, creating a bow-like tension in their body. This extension is what transforms a loose collar grip into a tight choke. Extension variation: some practitioners prefer explosive extension, others use progressive pressure. The speed and force of extension should match your training context - slow and controlled in practice, more dynamic in competition. As you extend, monitor your partner’s tap signals constantly. (Timing: 2-4 seconds from start of extension to full pressure) [Pressure: Firm]
  6. Final adjustments and pressure maintenance: With legs extended, make micro-adjustments to maximize pressure. Pull your choking elbow toward your ribs to tighten the collar around their neck. Adjust your body angle slightly if needed - small changes in hip position can significantly affect choking pressure. Ensure your shoulder is driving into the back of their head to prevent them from relieving pressure by chin tucking. Maintain all grips and pressure consistently until the tap comes. If the choke isn’t working after 3-5 seconds of full pressure, there’s a technical error - don’t simply squeeze harder, reassess your grip depth and body angle. (Timing: 1-3 seconds for adjustments) [Pressure: Maximum]
  7. Variation transitions based on defense: If the initial variation is defended, seamlessly transition to alternative configurations. If they defend by grabbing your choking hand, switch to a two-handed lapel feed variation. If they turn into you, transition to truck-based bow and arrow. If they push your leg off their shoulder, adjust to the hip-based variation. The key to variation mastery is recognizing defensive patterns and having prepared responses. Each defensive action opens a different variation pathway. Maintain constant pressure throughout transitions - never fully release control while switching between variations. (Timing: Variable based on opponent response) [Pressure: Moderate]

Opponent Defenses

  • Grabbing the choking hand/wrist to prevent lapel tightening (Effectiveness: Medium) - Your Adjustment: Use your non-choking hand to strip their grip, or transition to a two-on-one lapel feed where both your hands feed the lapel across for the choke. Alternatively, abandon this variation and switch to rear naked choke or arm trap variation.
  • Tucking chin deeply and hunching shoulders to block lapel access (Effectiveness: High) - Your Adjustment: Establish the position before they fully defend, or use your shoulder pressure against the back of their head while using your non-choking hand to create space under their chin. Consider transitioning to armbar or triangle from back instead.
  • Pushing against the top leg to prevent full extension (Effectiveness: Medium) - Your Adjustment: Switch to the low variation using hip control instead of shoulder control, or use your non-choking hand to trap their defending arm. You can also fake the leg extension to get them to commit their hands, then adjust your angle.
  • Turning into you to eliminate back control and the angle (Effectiveness: Low) - Your Adjustment: Excellent - this turn actually gifts you the truck position. Maintain your lapel grip and transition to the truck-based bow and arrow variation, which is often tighter than the standard version. Their defensive turn becomes your offensive transition.
  • Straightening their body and creating stiffness to resist the bow shape (Effectiveness: Low) - Your Adjustment: Their stiffness actually helps you create the extension needed for the choke. Increase your hip angle and leg extension to overcome their rigid posture. Their tension works against them as they cannot maintain stiffness indefinitely.

Common Mistakes

  • Mistake: Releasing back control prematurely before establishing the lapel grip securely [Low DANGER]
    • Consequence: Opponent escapes completely as you have neither back control nor a functional choke setup, losing the dominant position entirely
    • Correction: Maintain at least one hook and your seat belt until your choking hand has achieved a deep lapel grip that cannot be easily broken. Only then begin the transition to bow and arrow position.
  • Mistake: Shallow lapel grip that doesn’t reach past the opponent’s carotid artery [Medium DANGER]
    • Consequence: No blood choke develops even with full leg extension - results in ineffective air choke or pure neck crank that causes discomfort without finishing
    • Correction: Establish grip depth before everything else. Your fingers should be able to touch the opposite side of their neck through the collar. If you cannot get depth, use your non-choking hand to open space or choose a different submission.
  • Mistake: Insufficient hip angle - staying too close to parallel with opponent’s spine [Low DANGER]
    • Consequence: Leg extension creates pushing force rather than bow-shaped tension, allowing opponent to posture and escape while the choke never tightens properly
    • Correction: Escape your hips until you are approximately 90 degrees to their spine. Your shoulders should be positioned perpendicular to their back. The angle is as important as the grip for choking mechanics.
  • Mistake: Extending legs explosively without building progressive pressure [CRITICAL DANGER]
    • Consequence: Risk of neck injury to training partner and development of poor technique that won’t work against experienced opponents who will defend the explosion
    • Correction: Build pressure gradually over 3-5 seconds, especially in training. Progressive pressure allows partner to tap safely and develops the sensitivity needed to finish against resistant opponents.
  • Mistake: Focusing entirely on leg extension while neglecting hand/arm mechanics [Low DANGER]
    • Consequence: The collar loosens as you extend your legs, creating space that eliminates choking pressure despite proper body positioning
    • Correction: As you extend your legs, simultaneously pull your choking elbow toward your ribs and drive your shoulder into their head. Hand, leg, and shoulder actions must coordinate - any single element alone is insufficient.
  • Mistake: Not monitoring tap signals during the finishing sequence [CRITICAL DANGER]
    • Consequence: Partner loses consciousness or suffers neck injury because taps were missed during the intense focus on technique execution
    • Correction: Maintain constant awareness of your partner’s tapping throughout the submission. If you cannot see their hands, feel for taps on your body. If they go limp or stop resisting suddenly, release immediately even without a tap.
  • Mistake: Using only neck cranking pressure without proper collar positioning [High DANGER]
    • Consequence: Creates painful cervical spine stress without functional blood choke, leading to injury risk and developing ineffective submission mechanics
    • Correction: Ensure your lapel is positioned over the carotid arteries, not just wrapped around the neck. The finish should come from circulation restriction, not pure cranking. If it feels like a neck crank, adjust your collar position.

Variations

High Shoulder Variation: Instead of placing the top leg across the hip, bring it high over the opponent’s shoulder and neck area. This variation creates downward pressure in addition to the extension force, making it particularly effective against opponents who maintain strong posture. The high leg position also limits their ability to turn into you. (When to use: When opponent is defending with excellent posture and neck strength, or when you have long legs relative to their torso length. Also effective against opponents who successfully defend standard hip-based variations.)

Truck-Based Bow and Arrow: When the opponent turns into you defensively, maintain your lapel grip and transition to truck position with both legs controlling their lower body. From truck, establish the bow and arrow with the lapel already across their neck. This variation is often tighter than standard because their defensive turn has gifted you better angle. (When to use: When opponent attempts to escape back control by turning into you, or when you enter from truck position initially. This is a reactive variation that capitalizes on their defensive movement.)

Two-Handed Lapel Feed: Use both hands to feed the lapel across the neck rather than establishing the grip with one hand. One hand grips the lapel at the shoulder, the other catches it under the chin and pulls it across. Once fed deeply, release the feeding hand and establish leg position. This variation overcomes strong grip-fighting defense. (When to use: Against opponents who excel at fighting single grips and preventing deep collar access, or when you have limited initial collar depth from back control. The two-hand feed generates more power than single-hand establishment.)

Low Hip Variation with Modified Angle: Keep the top leg lower across their hip rather than shoulder, but compensate by taking a more acute angle (less than 90 degrees toward their legs). This creates the bow tension through hip control rather than shoulder control. Often combined with a second grip on their belt or pants to enhance lower body control. (When to use: When opponent successfully defends against shoulder-based variations, or when you have shorter limbs that make the high variation difficult. Also effective against flexible opponents who can defend high shoulder pressure.)

Arm-Trapped Bow and Arrow: Before transitioning to bow and arrow, trap the opponent’s near arm by threading your non-choking arm through and securing their wrist. This eliminates one entire defensive pathway. Proceed with bow and arrow setup knowing they cannot use that arm to defend the lapel or push your leg. (When to use: When you successfully secure gift wrap or arm trap control from back, or when opponent is over-relying on one-arm defenses. This variation is highly controlling but requires extra setup time.)

Crucifix Entry Bow and Arrow: From crucifix position, maintain your arm control while establishing the lapel grip, then transition to bow and arrow configuration. This is effectively a bow and arrow where both arms are controlled, making it virtually inescapable once established. (When to use: When you achieve crucifix control and opponent is defending other crucifix submissions. The positional control is so dominant that the bow and arrow becomes a high-percentage finish even if they see it coming.)

Test Your Knowledge

Q1: Why is lapel grip depth more important than grip strength when establishing the bow and arrow choke? A: Grip depth determines whether your hand is positioned over the carotid artery on the far side of the opponent’s neck, which is the actual target for blood choke mechanics. A strong grip on a shallow collar position will never create a functional blood choke regardless of how tightly you squeeze, while a deep grip with moderate pressure positioned correctly over the carotid arteries will create effective circulation restriction. The depth places the choking mechanism in the correct anatomical position - strength without position is ineffective.

Q2: What are the immediate steps you must take if your training partner goes limp or unresponsive during a bow and arrow choke application? [SAFETY-CRITICAL] A: Immediately release the lapel grip completely and remove all pressure from their neck. Straighten their body by removing your leg extension and allow them to lie flat. Check for consciousness and breathing - they should recover quickly if you released promptly. If they do not regain consciousness within 5-10 seconds, call for immediate help. Never attempt to continue training after such an incident - allow them complete recovery time and consider whether your application speed was too aggressive. This situation indicates the choke was held too long or applied too quickly without adequate tap opportunity.

Q3: Explain how the hip angle relative to the opponent’s spine affects the mechanical efficiency of the bow and arrow choke variations? A: The hip angle determines the vector of force when you extend your legs, which directly affects how that force translates into choking pressure versus pushing force. At approximately 90 degrees to their spine, leg extension creates perpendicular force that bows their body and tightens the collar around their neck. At angles too parallel to their spine (less than 60 degrees), leg extension simply pushes them away without creating the bow-shaped tension needed for the choke. At angles too acute (more than 110 degrees toward their legs), you lose connection and they can escape. The optimal angle creates maximum bow tension while maintaining body connection.

Q4: Why do the variations described use different leg positions (hip, shoulder, or both hooks), and how should you choose which variation to employ? A: Different leg positions address different defensive postures and body types while creating the same fundamental bow-shaped tension through different mechanical pathways. High shoulder variation works when opponent has excellent posture defense and you need downward pressure. Low hip variation succeeds when they defend the shoulder position or when you have shorter legs. Truck-based variation (both hooks) capitalizes on their defensive turn. The choice should be based on: their current defensive posture, their body dimensions relative to yours, which grips you’ve already established, and which defensive patterns they’re showing. Variation mastery means reading these factors and selecting the optimal configuration dynamically.

Q5: What is the difference between a blood choke and a neck crank in the context of bow and arrow variations, and why is this distinction critical for safety? [SAFETY-CRITICAL] A: A blood choke restricts blood flow through the carotid arteries to the brain, causing relatively safe and quick loss of consciousness if held too long, with complete recovery when released promptly. A neck crank applies force to the cervical spine and surrounding structures, creating pain through joint stress and potential for serious spinal injury, ligament damage, or nerve damage without causing unconsciousness. In bow and arrow variations, proper collar position over the carotid arteries creates blood choke mechanics - this is safe when applied progressively. Improper position that cranks the neck creates injury risk without effective submission. The distinction is critical because neck cranks can cause lasting injury while blood chokes are relatively safe with proper application and release protocols.

Q6: How should training intensity and application speed differ between drilling, situational sparring, and competition for bow and arrow choke variations? [SAFETY-CRITICAL] A: Drilling phase: apply no finishing pressure - stop at control position with collar grip established and legs positioned, but don’t extend to create choking pressure. Situational sparring: apply progressive pressure over 4-5 seconds, stop immediately at tap, and prioritize partner safety over finish. Allow partner clear tap access and never spike the pressure suddenly. Competition: apply progressive but quicker pressure (2-3 seconds), finish with authority once controlled, but still monitor referee stoppage and opponent tap constantly. The fundamental principle is that training should always prioritize safety and technical development over submission counts, while competition appropriately increases intensity within safe parameters. Never treat training partners like competition opponents in terms of submission finishing.

Q7: What mechanical principle explains why leg extension is necessary for bow and arrow effectiveness, and what happens if you try to finish without proper extension? A: Leg extension creates tension along the length of the opponent’s body that transforms them into a bow shape - their body becomes the bow, your legs become the string pulling to create tension, and their rigid spine resists this tension by forcing the collar to tighten around their neck. Without leg extension, there is insufficient force to overcome the natural slack in the gi collar and the space between collar and neck. The lapel grip alone cannot generate enough mechanical advantage - the legs provide the force multiplier by using your hip and leg strength against their entire body structure. Attempting to finish without extension results in a loose choke that creates discomfort but no legitimate finish.

Training Progressions

Technical Understanding (Week 1-2)

  • Focus: Learn grip mechanics, body positioning, and variation differences through demonstration and solo drilling. Practice lapel feeding on stationary partner. Understand anatomical targets and safety requirements before any live practice.
  • Resistance: None
  • Safety: Study tap signals, release protocols, and difference between blood choke versus neck crank. Understand that this phase involves zero pressure - only positioning.

Slow Cooperative Practice (Week 3-4)

  • Focus: Practice all variations from established back control with fully cooperative partner. Stop at control position without applying finishing pressure. Partner provides feedback on grip depth and body angle. Rotate through all major variations to understand their differences.
  • Resistance: Zero resistance
  • Safety: Apply no choking pressure - stop when collar grip is deep and legs are positioned. Partner verbally indicates when collar position feels correct. Practice release protocol multiple times.

Light Resistance Drilling (Week 5-8)

  • Focus: Partner provides mild defensive resistance - light grip fighting, postural defense, and basic escape attempts. Practice reading which variation is most appropriate based on their defense. Begin applying very light pressure (20-30% intensity) to understand feedback, stopping well before any discomfort.
  • Resistance: Mild resistance
  • Safety: Application takes minimum 5-7 seconds. Partner taps early to indicate proper pressure development. Emphasize technical precision over force.

Moderate Resistance with Variation Selection (Week 9-16)

  • Focus: Partner provides realistic but not maximal defensive resistance. Practice seamlessly transitioning between variations based on their defensive patterns. Begin applying moderate pressure (50-60% intensity) that creates genuine choking sensation but with slow progressive build-up.
  • Resistance: Realistic resistance
  • Safety: Minimum 4-5 second application time from start of pressure to full intensity. Both practitioners monitor tap signals constantly. Discuss technique after each repetition to ensure safety.

Live Situational Sparring (Week 17-24)

  • Focus: Start from back control with live resistance - partner attempts realistic escapes while you work to establish and finish bow and arrow variations. Apply competition-style pressure but in training context with safety priority. Practice the complete chain from back control maintenance through variation selection to finish.
  • Resistance: Full resistance
  • Safety: Apply progressive pressure over 3-4 seconds minimum. Release immediately at tap with no delay. Never hold choke after tap to ‘teach a lesson’ or prove the technique works. Partner must have clear tap access at all times.

Competition Preparation (Week 25+)

  • Focus: Integrate bow and arrow variations into full positional sparring from all positions. Practice transitions from various back takes into immediate bow and arrow setups. Develop automatic variation selection based on opponent defensive patterns. Train both tournament pacing and application timing.
  • Resistance: Full resistance
  • Safety: Maintain 3-second minimum application even in competition simulation. Develop habit of immediate release at tap that will carry over to competition. Practice situational awareness to ensure referee can see tap signals in competition context.

From Which Positions?

Expert Insights

  • Danaher System: The bow and arrow choke system represents an elegant biomechanical solution to the problem of finishing from back control when the rear naked choke is defended. The fundamental mechanical principle is the transformation of the opponent’s body into a rigid structure under tension - their spine becomes a lever against which your leg extension creates force that tightens the collar. What makes this system particularly valuable is the variation component. Many practitioners learn a single bow and arrow configuration and become frustrated when experienced opponents defend that specific setup. The solution is understanding that the core principle - lapel depth plus body tension through leg extension - can be achieved through multiple pathways. Each variation addresses a specific defensive pattern. When the opponent defends the shoulder position, switch to the hip-based variation. When they defend by turning, capitalize on their movement to enter the truck-based variation. The technical sophistication lies not in perfecting one variation but in seamlessly flowing between variations based on real-time defensive feedback. From a safety perspective, practitioners must understand that this technique can create both blood choke and neck crank mechanics depending on collar placement. Proper technique targets the carotid arteries through deep collar position - this creates legitimate blood choke that is relatively safe when applied progressively and released promptly. Shallow collar position or improper angle creates neck cranking force that is both less effective as a submission and more dangerous as a potential injury mechanism. The training emphasis must be on achieving sufficient collar depth that the carotid compression occurs before any significant cervical spine stress develops.
  • Gordon Ryan: The bow and arrow has been one of my most reliable finishes from back control in competition because it’s fundamentally difficult to defend once I achieve the proper collar grip depth. In competition, I’ve found that the setup is actually more important than the finish - if I can get my hand deep into their collar while maintaining back control, the finish becomes almost inevitable. The key competition insight is that most opponents will defend the rear naked choke much more aggressively than they defend collar grips, which creates an opening. I’ll often threaten the rear naked to get them focused on defending under their chin, then switch to establishing the deep collar grip while their hands are occupied. Once I have that grip, I’m very patient about transitioning to the bow and arrow position - there’s no rush because they cannot break a properly established deep collar grip. In terms of variation selection in competition, I prefer the high shoulder variation because it creates multiple pressure points - they’re dealing with the choke, the extension, and the weight of my leg on their shoulder simultaneously. This multi-point pressure accelerates the finish and makes it harder for them to maintain composure. The truck-based variation is also exceptional when opponents attempt to escape back control by turning into me - their escape attempt becomes my submission setup. One critical competition versus training distinction: in training, I build pressure over 4-5 seconds and focus on perfect technique with zero injury risk. In competition, I still apply pressure progressively over 2-3 seconds but with much more authority once I have the control position locked. The progressive application is important even in competition because explosive applications can be defended more easily by explosive athletes. The finish should feel inevitable, not sudden.
  • Eddie Bravo: The bow and arrow is one of those techniques where the gi creates possibilities that just don’t exist in no-gi, and understanding why reveals important principles about leverage and mechanical advantage. The lapel essentially gives you a handle on their neck that you can manipulate from a distance - you’re not limited by the length of your arms like you are with the rear naked choke. This distance principle is why I teach students to think of gi chokes as long-range submissions compared to no-gi chokes. In the 10th Planet system, we don’t train gi so we don’t use bow and arrow, but I always tell students who do train gi to master this because it’s a perfect example of using the equipment available to create superior leverage. The variation concept is pure 10th Planet philosophy - don’t just learn one path, build a system of interconnected options that feed off each other. When I see high-level gi players hitting bow and arrow variations seamlessly, they’re demonstrating the same principle we use in rubber guard or truck - having multiple attacking options from the same control position where each option counters specific defenses. From a safety culture perspective, the bow and arrow is a great technique for teaching the difference between pain compliance and legitimate finish. A shallow collar bow and arrow creates a lot of neck discomfort without really threatening the finish - that’s pain compliance, and it teaches students to tough out discomfort rather than tapping to legitimate submissions. A deep collar bow and arrow creates relatively little discomfort until the blood choke begins affecting consciousness - that’s a legitimate finish, and it teaches students to respect proper technique. In training, we need to be developing the second type, not the first type. That means prioritizing collar depth and proper positioning over force and pain creation. The goal is technical excellence that creates inevitable finishes, not pain tolerance contests that create tough guys with poor technique.